Autor |
Beitrag |
Hannah
Mitglied
Beiträge: 8 Ort: Düsseldorf / Uni. of Wuppertal
|
Erstellt: 11.09.06, 05:43 Betreff: neat little structure
drucken
Thema drucken weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
This is a linuistic forum, so I have a little structure for you that I came across, but can't even give a name although it's from my native tonge:
(1) a. Stellen wir uns einmal vor... Imagine we us once PARTICLE ' Let's imagine...'
b. Gehen wir das nochmal durch: ... Go we this again through 'Let's go through this again: ...'
c. Nehmen wir also an... Assume we therefore PARTICLE 'Therefore, let's assume...'
(Hope I do the glossing right!) Funny thing about these sentences is that they are verb initial which is in German usually only found in imparatives. But this can't be imparatives because they are not 2nd person. German imparatives largely work just as you know it from English. As far as I thought about it, I found this structure to be highly restricted: you find it only with 1st peron plural (all you other native speakers of German, feel free to correct me on this!), and it seems to be a discourse marker. You can use it only to open a new "paragraph" in the discourse, a conclusion, a final going through a plan, or a possible result.
So, what you think? Any ideas for what this funny animal might be? Do you have other examples of this structure?
Looking foreward to read your answers!!
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Olga
Gast
|
Erstellt: 11.09.06, 19:22 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
Looking at the examples I spontanously remembered the "hortativ" in latin, which had I similar structure with the "jussiv". And the jussiv has the same function as the imperativ do. So probably this similarity in function causes also similar constructions in German?
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Hannah
Mitglied
Beiträge: 8 Ort: Düsseldorf / Uni. of Wuppertal
|
Erstellt: 11.09.06, 20:32 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
I know it is hard, but can you give an example for Latin? Learning Latin was a pain for me and I forgot most of it as fast as I could. What is the 'hortative' and what was it for?
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Olga
Gast
|
Erstellt: 12.09.06, 08:57 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
Hortativ is an "appeal" and it is used only in the 1. PL. Konj. An example could be something like this:
Eamus! Let's go!
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Basia
Gast
|
Erstellt: 13.09.06, 21:24 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
I can't remeber much about Latin grammar. Was hortative morphology much different from imperative? why can't those German structures be imperatives? imperatives can be 1st Pers.
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Basia
Gast
|
Erstellt: 13.09.06, 21:29 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
By the way - this is my first time at the Forum - I want to say Hi to everyone! I'm really happy I met so many great people at the school!
and ...
one question - has anyone heard anything about it that all the handouts from all classes were going to be made available on the internet ??
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Admin
Administrator
Beiträge: 8
|
Erstellt: 14.09.06, 17:38 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
No idea, but I will be verz interested in information about it (handouts!)! Hey Basia, nice to meet you here!:-)
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Basia
Gast
|
Erstellt: 15.09.06, 22:36 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
so, what's up with the little structure? :D can't it be 1st Pers. imperative??
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Hannah
Mitglied
Beiträge: 8 Ort: Düsseldorf / Uni. of Wuppertal
|
Erstellt: 16.09.06, 12:06 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
That's the problems with studying English: I applied grammatic rules for English to German and forgot to see the simplest way *blush* You're probably right. Mystery solved! :D
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Jens
Gast
|
Erstellt: 16.09.06, 12:38 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
Hello everybody, it looks to me like an imperative, especially when you look at it pragmatically. And I don’t see any reason, why it shouldn’t be possible to include yourself in the imperative, like in Gehen wir / Go.1PL we / Let’s go It is just that the imperative is not morphologically maked, but maybe structurally: what is he difference between „wir gehen“ and "gehen wir"? the first clause is an indicative with a topicalized subject in SpecCP. In the second example the subject is not topicalized (it stays say in Spec TP) and the finite verb is in C as usual. It’s the same structure like in questions. So only the intonation makes the difference between the question “gehen wir?” and the imperative “gehen wir!" OK, I am not specialized in Germanic languages. In fact, I’m not specialized at all. This is just a Sunday morning hang-over assumption. In fact it’s Saturday. I think it is an imperative. Regards jens
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Jens
Gast
|
Erstellt: 18.09.06, 14:11 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
hi, me again. your structure is an imperative. i looked it up in a german grammar and while usually imperative is 2nd person there are some constructions like "gehen wir" which are imperatives in 1st person just like "vamos" and "andiamo". vale. regards jens
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
Hannah
Mitglied
Beiträge: 8 Ort: Düsseldorf / Uni. of Wuppertal
|
Erstellt: 25.09.06, 18:15 Betreff: Re: neat little structure
drucken
weiterempfehlen
|
|
|
Wow, so we now got a first kind of linguistic discussion! This was one of the intentions of the forum! If only all those who read the topics, as can seen in the last colum on the front page, would also contribute to it, we'd have a really lively forum!!
|
|
nach oben |
|
|
|